With the Rugby Club Toulon season just over, President Bernard Lemaitre agreed to meet us at the Campus, in his office. The goal? To retrace, without mincing words, the 2023-2024 season before looking ahead. Qualification, a dip in temperature during the winter, maintaining confidence in the staff, his immediate future at the club, the creation of a fan zone, transfers… The strong man of the RCT covers all the major topics.
Before the barrage against La Rochelle, you spoke of a “part of satisfaction”. After the defeat, has the balance sheet changed?
No, it’s the same. The objective set, in agreement with Pierre Mignoni, was to finish in the top four. We even finished with the same number of points as the third-placed team, Bordeaux. From the moment the final phase begins, there is an element of the unpredictable, the unpredictable. That’s what happened. I’m generally satisfied, even if there are still, deep down, a lot of regrets. But what does a season depend on? On a result, on nothing at all… we inevitably think a little.
Despite being eliminated in the play-offs, it had been six years since Toulon had tasted the final phase. Is this your best season at the helm of the club?
In terms of results, yes. Because we made it to the end of the season. But the best in terms of rugby, I think it was the one where we were fourth before the lockdown stopped the championship. [2019-2020]. It’s ancient history, but I think we had been more regular.
So this season is more successful than last year, which ended with a Challenge Cup title?
For me, yes. The championship is irreplaceable. We are very happy to have won the Challenge Cup for the first time in the club’s history, but yes.
You mention the lack of regularity. Finishing in 4th placee place is it ultimately annoying, when we observe the hole experienced by the club from December to March?
It leaves some regrets. What’s the point? The try conceded two minutes from the end against Bordeaux, when we had possession in their half, for example. Or some very bad away matches, in which we didn’t deserve to win. And others where we played very well, including sometimes with “light” teams. Like in La Rochelle. If we transform this penalty which is offered to us twice at the end of the match… The outcome is completely different. But it’s like that.
To return to this slump, in the middle of winter, the RCT lost 10 matches out of 13. Given your position as president, could this have created a form of weariness?
Never tired! On the other hand, a little blow to morale, because I’m like everyone else. We experience periods of disappointment, we fight against ourselves, against the environment. In a club as in a company, what you need is to manage to stay on your feet even in the face of difficulty. Let everyone see that not only are we here, but that we are working. But I must admit, there are Monday mornings that are hard.
This year, the Champions Cup was also a missed opportunity…
A big disappointment, yes. Even if there is no match where we were ridiculous. Maybe we were slightly dominated by the Munster team. Otherwise, we came close to victory against Northampton and Exeter. I am very confident for the future. Because I think it is relatively easy to do better. We are not far away.
Is it possible to say, as president, that you are not far away? That with a little time, it can work?
Of course. You know, when you work closely as I do with Pierre Mignoni, you share everything. You don’t hide anything from each other. He’s not the kind of person who hides behind excuses. From there, you know where it didn’t work, where you’re not good enough. So you tell yourself that you’re not far off, and that next time, you’ll do things better.
Have you thought, during this negative spiral, of shaking up your staff? To inject new blood as an electroshock?
I’m not someone who changes things every five minutes. It’s not a question of loyalty, but of evaluating situations. In rugby, as in many other areas, what works is a form of continuity and confidence. When there is a good atmosphere in a team, intrinsic qualities of players, but the mayonnaise has not yet set well, we tell ourselves that we must persevere, continue to work. As many know, in professional rugby, great teams are built over several years.
We often talk about the staff which is an “easier” lever to activate, but have you been disappointed by certain players?
Some players, whom I will not name, have not been at the level we expected them to be. They have not been faithful and consistent with their reputation, their experience. That is clear. So we ask ourselves questions.
You don’t usually speak in front of the group. This year, you did it only once, before the reception of Perpignan. Why?
I felt that there was a decisive moment in the season. I asked Pierre to put the group of 23, and not one more, in a room. Perpignan was in full swing, and we really needed to straighten up. I had to do it. Otherwise, I don’t interfere in the sporting side. But I’m there. I listen, I observe, from time to time when I say hello I make a remark to them that shows that I am aware of their situation, personal or rugby-wise, positive or negative. And they know. They know that I know.
What did you say to the players?
These are personal things, parts of my life. Some people know that I could be their great-grandfather, or even their grandfather, but none of them know their father. I have a certain precedence. Those who know that I was born before the Second World War, they don’t necessarily know what that is (laughs). So I’ve experienced quite a few things in my life, of different kinds, and sometimes I choose one, which seems appropriate to me in relation to what the team is experiencing.
This season, you also tried to recreate exchanges with the supporters. Was this important to you?
We had a meeting, during which everyone was invited. Unfortunately, there were only 150 of us, when there could have been 500 or 600.
You are often questioned by supporters. How do you deal with these criticisms on a daily basis?
As long as it’s a review, it’s fine. What I don’t experience well, even if I’m starting to distance myself a little, is when it borders on insulting. Or that it really is. Particularly because I know it comes from people who don’t know what we really do at the club. They ignore it, or want to ignore it. Because there has been enough information, for four to five years, on the club’s project, on the means with which we are trying to equip ourselves to make progress. Whether in terms of infrastructure, which is a unique effort in the world of rugby. We will do this meeting again in the future. With the idea of informing as many people as possible. Not everything is a success, that’s clear. But I am convinced that in this respect, this meeting was useful.
Do you ever think, when you go home alone, that with all the investment you put into the club, you deserve to be better supported? With more indulgence?
I don’t tell myself that, no. I believe we get what we deserve. Afterwards, it depends on who we are judged by. Today, I am in a period where I have accepted this. When it affects me personally, it affects my family much more, which is very rugby-loving. They read everything on the RCT, teaching me lots of things that I don’t even read (laughs). So yes, it has more impact. Necessarily. But it’s the man who speaks. Not the president.
Now that the season is over, what direction will you set for your players and your staff for next season?
About the same when it comes to the regular championship season. You absolutely have to be in the top four, and if possible a little better. I think it’s achievable as the team will get even stronger. With players who could be described as second or third tier, in order to guard against selections and injuries. We haven’t quite finished our recruitment, there are two or three pieces of news waiting for us. I hope we will succeed. I have good hope!
