[This contains major spoilers from part two of Outer Banks season four.]
Netflix‘s Outer Banks season four began and ended with JJ.
The Pogue-iest of the Pogues, per the showrunners, Rudy Pankow‘s erratic-yet-lovable JJ Maybank caused and concluded the fourth season’s main conflict, which saw the group of North Carolina teen treasure hunters inherit and lose over a million dollars, delve deep into JJ’s family history and trek across the Atlantic for an epic showdown in Morocco.
The nearly 90-minute finale episode, released Thursday along with the second half of season four‘s 10 episodes, saw the group race through the North African desert in an ultimate standoff against the man who turned out to be JJ’s real father. In the final moments of the season — now officially the penultimate of the show, after Tuesday’s fifth and final renewal — JJ dies.
“It’s been kind of lurking in his DNA from the beginning,” showrunner Jonas Pate tells The Hollywood Reporter. “He’s really a lovable but tragic figure… this is something that was always sort of baked in the cake.”
Fate or not, JJ’s end is sure to spark shock in the Netflix drama’s fervent online fan base. “What do you think the fans are going to do — do we need witness protection?” Pate quipped on Wednesday, before the season’s part two release.
Below, Jonas Pate joins fellow showrunners Josh Pate and Shannon Burke to reflect on why it always had to be JJ, why it ended up being Morocco and exactly how that beloved P4L mentality will continue to guide their show going forward.
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What a season for JJ. Was this something you’d planned from the beginning?
SHANNON BURKE We knew — we knew at the end of season three that season four was going to be JJ. We didn’t know everything that was going to happen, but we had a lot of the major story points. We sort of knew what JJ’s ultimate end was going to be, too — we weren’t sure if it was going to be played in this year, but we pretty much knew.
JOSH PATE We’ve kind of put the spotlight on different characters, and we were excited to go deeper into his backstory. And then a big piece that we developed this year was the idea of the adoptive father, like the big villain. We had to repurpose the villains, because after the first three seasons, it was a reset this year.
Why did he have to die?
JONAS PATE It’s been kind of lurking in his DNA from the beginning. He’s really a tragic figure, and the idea of mortality, and you only have a finite window — it’s also a theme of the show. It’s something John B has talked about from the first season. So believe it or not, this is something that was always sort of baked in the cake, and we just wanted to tell the story as elegantly and interestingly as possible.
This finale is quite the beast — almost 90 minutes, all set in Morocco. From a technical perspective, what’s it like figuring out the pacing of an episode that is going to be so much longer than what your audience is used to?
SHANNON BURKE That just happened organically. We didn’t go in thinking that we’re going to make this really long episode. We realized, bit by bit, the script kept just getting longer, and we just wanted to honor the story. Initially, we had a shorter version, but it didn’t honor what was going to happen. We realized we needed to slow it down so it’s more something that happens bit by bit.
JONAS PATE You also do it post. We knew this one was long, but you get in post and then it was much longer than we expected, and the you save it from there.
Was there any pushback from Netflix?
JONAS PATE I think they knew we had a lot of planes to land it was probably going to be long. Netflix are exceptional partners about letting the story be the thing that needs to be told. I think they’ve shown that with a lot of their shows, like Stranger Things.
Let’s talk about the journey to Morocco. These Pogues have been all over the world at this point, what pointed you there this time?
JONAS PATE There’s a lot that goes into it. Part of it is driven by the story, part of it is driven by what we think is going to be cinematic, part of it is driven by some financial concerns. But the story is number one.
JOSH PATE It was almost like it was Pogue hell. It’s a desert! The anti-Pogue environment. Since we knew what was going to happen to JJ, it was like, “Wow, this is perfect.” Because it’s literally like the last place they want to be. They’re so beachy and water-based.
That’s true, Poguelandia it is not. Did that factor into your specific set design or location scouting?
JOSH PATE We definitely knew that the endpoint was going to be out in the desert, in the Sahara, some place that was very different from [what they know and love]. [The city] where we shot the finale, [where the Pogues embark on multiple chase scenes through the dusty streets]we basically had to rewrite the whole script once we were in Morocco for that new location, because Jonas was so excited about what we could do in that kind of clay city on the hill. So that was all rewired based on the location.
Let’s talk about the rest of the Pogues. This show feels different from other teen adventures given that all the main couples tend to stick together. Was that a conscious decision for you?
SHANNON BURKE I think we like these characters so much. We don’t want them to be low motive or petty. We don’t like when they do bad things, and we like it when they’re good to each other.
JONAS PATE And we wanted to honor P4L. I mean, that’s really what this is about. We wanted to give them external problems, but not as many external problems.
Sarah Cameron is pregnant!
JONAS PATE We didn’t want John B and Sarah to have the usual breakup architecture of a YA couple, but we also needed them to face [conflict]. And there’s always this charge you get when you have an interesting idea and you’re almost afraid of it. The first few times we discussed that idea, it was like, “Oh my God, we can’t do that!” But those are often the ideas that kind of haunt you. It gets the engine revving.
Who decided to call it a “poguelet?”
JOSH PATE I think Carlacia [Grant, who plays Cleo] ad-libbed that on set, it was so funny.
That’s great. My last question for you — these characters have grown and evolved so much, but they’re still so young. Is there a balance to strike with the adventure of the show and the age of your characters?
JOSH PATE I would just say a lot of their boundaries are [based on] our memories of our teen years, which come from spending time in the coastal Carolinas. The original concept of Kooks and Pogues were based on groups we knew, and I just think about those groups and what their boundaries would be like and what kind of stuff happened.
JONAS PATE We had friends in high school who got pregnant. We just felt like it was a real thing.
JOSH PATE It would be something that could so easily happen to them. But we want to honor the pickle that it presents them and be true to the characters.
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Parts one and two of Outer Banks season four are now streaming on Netflix.
