“Mr. Aznavour, the best shoot of my life”

Paris Match. Who was Charles Aznavour for you before the film?
Tahar Rahim. A great French personality, someone I always felt close to because his songs were everywhere. He had established himself in people’s lives, on the radio, on TV, on stage, he was very rooted in French culture. Yet deep down I didn’t know him at all.

Did we listen to Aznavour at your house?
Of course, my mother, my brothers, my sisters, but we didn’t just listen to that. It was when I arrived in Paris, at the age of 23, that I immersed myself in his songs. I had his “40 greatest songs” on my little Discman which jumped at every step and I discovered things like “Je m’voyais déjà” or “The comedians” and that made me feel good. It corresponded to what I was experiencing, to what I was dreaming of. He supported me in my goal of becoming an actor.

Twenty years later, the connections between his destiny and yours are obvious: two artists, sons of immigrants, who carry French culture throughout the world.
At the time, I wasn’t aware of it. But yes there are similarities. [Il sourit.] When Grand Corps Malade offered me the role, I didn’t think it was for me at all. Really not! I still asked for a little time to think and I did the work of an anthropologist by delving into all the archives that existed on the Internet. And then I saw him at one point always being in front of the others, pushing his shoulder to get out of a plane, a car. There, he charms me, I like him, I see something animal in him. And Leila [Bekhti, son épouse, NDLR] said to me: “No, but you do it!”

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And you went for it?
No ! I asked if we could wait until the makeup trials to make sure I wasn’t ridiculous. In reality I was already stung! [Il sourit.] When I feel like I could fail at everything, it triggers a survival instinct that makes me give everything I have. This is what motivates me the most when I do my job.

“Aznavour could be adorable, but at work he didn’t laugh”

Why do you think Aznavour lasted so long?
Because he was driven by rage, the son of immigrants. He didn’t have an innocent, carefree childhood like mine. He had to work from a very young age to help his family. And, at the same time, he had a lot of respect for work and self-sacrifice. With him, one doesn’t go without the other, I find myself completely in that. He could be adorable, but at work he didn’t laugh. Because he wanted to succeed, to be the best and to get out of his condition. I understand that too.

You, your vocation was clear at 14 years old.
At that moment, I am nourished by a naivety inherent in my person. For me, it makes sense to become an actor. My teenage fantasies transformed into passion, then into goals and finally into needs. I joined the sports school in Strasbourg because my sister told me that I absolutely needed a diploma. As I had nothing other than cinema, I went to film school in Montpellier and started theater classes. And then I saw that it was a real job… [Il sourit.]

Wasn’t it what you imagined?
Oh no! [Il éclate de rire.] I thought I was a good actor, because I came from the street school and had seen millions of movies. In fact, I had everything to learn: learn to speak, to move, learn my lines, understand what camera positioning is. It was a great lesson in humility.

I was so afraid of getting a big head that I knew how to keep it cool

Tahar Rahim

When Jacques Audiard casts you for “A Prophet”, are you ready?
You’re never ready for a role. But I’m ready to seize the opportunity. I don’t believe in luck. At some point, when the opportunity passes, you have to seize it. It’s a bit like a comet, you never know when it will come back.

A year later, you won two Césars for the same role. How did you keep your feet on the ground back then?
I was so afraid of getting upset that I knew how to keep it cool. I saw those who had their hour of glory and who now belong to the past, in football, in the cinema or elsewhere… So I closed myself off. My fears faded over time. Once you leave the waters, you have to know how to sail, then learn to sail. We had to go through that to be sustainable.

“Monsieur Aznavour” also marks your return to France. For three years, we had seen you a lot in international productions.
I don’t see things that way. After “A Prophet”, I refused all the roles of Arab criminals or terrorists that were offered to me in France. I wanted different things, not to feel narrow, labeled, even if it took time. And the offers came from abroad, from Kevin MacDonald, who offered me “The Eagle of the Ninth Legion”. Internationally, I was quickly looked at differently. Whereas in France for a long time the proposals remained the same. And as I like demanding cinema, I didn’t rush, I didn’t make bad choices for bad reasons. Well yes, once, but a long time ago, and I won’t tell you the name of the film… [Il sourit.]

Last year, you joined the Marvel team by starring in “Madame Web”. It was not at all successful.
It was even a downright cold shower… I had prepared myself, but I will never regret it because I made a childhood dream come true. A Marvel is a pretty crazy way to get into people’s homes. The problem for me is that what I read is not at all what I saw on the screen. The film is much worse than the initial promise. But that’s life, sometimes things don’t work out. I console myself by thinking of “Once Upon a Time in America…” which was hyped upon its release even though it is one of the greatest films of all time.

Is it hard to shoot on a green screen?
I was lucky not to be confronted with that too much. The hardest part is arriving every morning at 7 a.m. and sometimes not shooting until 7 p.m. I am very impatient, this wait was driving me crazy. And you can’t say “hey! guys, you know what? I’m going to the café next door to toast me and you page me when you’re ready”, like everything is done in the studio. I thought I was going crazy… I stayed four months in Boston in painful solitude, which reminded me of my student years.

“Without my mother, I would be nothing”

For you, filming is a monastic and solitary life?
Yes. Not that I like it, but I understand the necessity of it. So I accept it.

And isn’t it hard for Leïla and your children?
Sometimes yes, but as Leïla is a unique, exceptional person, she understands everything. She knows me. And then, when I’m there, I’m really there.

Without her, you would not have been able to succeed in your profession?
I am lucky to have him by my side. She literally carries me. And it is not a relationship of submission, that is very clear between us. I say it often, she is also my best friend. So, it finds its balance in our functioning. She is so selfless, she loves people so much, she gives so much of everything, she is so whole. I’ve never seen anyone so generous.

Are you paying attention to her?
Of course, she is my life! [Il sourit.]

You have often said how important your mother was also in your career, she always supported you.
Without her, I would be nothing. She is the first who believed in me, peace to her soul. She believed in it even stronger than me, when I got my first casting, she cried with joy. At 14, it was she who told me: “You’re going to do it one day, my son, you’ll become a gentleman.” So filming in “Monsieur Aznavour” is no small thing.

And your father?
He started his life again when I was a child. I saw him, there were no problems between us, he told me “it will work out”, but we didn’t talk more than that. What mattered to him was that I was happy and that I had a situation. He believed in my seriousness.

Would you be happy if your children turned to cinema?
When you come from where I come from, you develop a kind of rage, like Aznavour’s, which allows you to become immune to adversity and the harshness of this job. If you don’t have that, it’s very difficult. I will be demanding with my children, I will not hide the reality of this profession from them, I would not want it to be a hobby or a fantasy based on bad reasons. But they are still small. And if they are happy growing vegetables in the countryside, I will be happy too.

Having actor parents can sometimes create a tropism…
Right now, they don’t know what we’re doing. Only the big ones are starting to get it, but they don’t come to our shoots, we protect them as much as we can from notoriety and from that world.

If he hadn’t become an actor…

Are you comfortable with fame?
I know it exists, but I don’t experience it that much. I actually thought about it a lot before. I understood that there were traps that I did not want to fall into. Clearly, if you want notoriety, you have to reveal too much of yourself. But a director likes to reveal things in you. If he knows you too much, you no longer inspire him with desire. Or less and less…

If you hadn’t been an actor, would you have been the unhappiest of men?
I had a plan B: travel the world with my backpack in search of a vocation. Until I came across it.

It was happening somewhere else, then?
Yes, but I grew up elsewhere. My France was the whole world. In my tower, in Belfort, I didn’t need to take a plane or save money to travel. There were people from Asia, France, sub-Saharan Africa, travelers. And I tasted all the cultures. This is France as it is today, the one that they try to make us believe does not exist. And, precisely, it is this France that I found on “Monsieur Aznavour”, the best filming of my life. With Grand Corps Malade, Mehdi Idir, Jean-Rachid and David Bertrand, we all come from below. And we built this film with family happiness, we all left our egos in the closet. This story proves that it is possible. And when that happens, we are stronger than ever.